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Hearing: 13th February 2009, day 16
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PUBLIC INQUIRY INTO THE DEATH OF
ROBERT HAMILL
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Held at:
Interpoint
20-24 York Street
Belfast
on Friday, 13th February 2009
commencing at 10.30 am
Day 16
1 Friday, 13 February 2009
2 (10.30 am)
3 MR UNDERWOOD: Good morning. May I call Stephen Bloomer,
4 please?
5 MR STEPHEN BLOOMER (sworn)
6 Examination by MR UNDERWOOD
7 MR UNDERWOOD: Morning, Mr Bloomer. My name is Underwood
8 and I appear for the Inquiry. I will be asking you
9 questions to start with. May I ask you your full names?
10 A. Stephen James Bloomer.
11 Q. May I ask you to look at the screen? What we have here
12 is a model of Portadown as it was in April 1997. If we
13 scroll round we can see a 360 view from here. I will
14 let you familiarise yourself with it. That's down
15 Thomas Street.
16 A. Okay.
17 Q. This is the way up to the church.
18 A. Mm-hm.
19 Q. And then there's Woodhouse Street there. If we stop it
20 there, and off down Market Street, High Street to the
21 right.
22 A. Okay.
23 Q. What we are interested in is whether RUC officers got
24 out of a Land Rover, at a time when they could and should
25 have done, to help Mr Hamill, who was being attacked, and
1
1 we are interested in what the police officers might have
2 seen while they were there as well.
3 Now, having shown you that, and told you that,
4 can I take you to some of the documents that we have
5 got?
6 First of all, if we look at page [08121] this is
7 a document you have probably never seen before. It's
8 something called a QPF. It is a questionnaire, and what
9 was going on was that shortly after the incident on
10 27 April 1997, police officers were going round
11 interviewing anybody who they thought might have been
12 anywhere near the scene, to see if they could get any
13 evidence.
14 They had this standard form that was typed as
15 a series of questions and it had gaps for officers to
16 write in any answers they managed to get out of anybody
17 and they were then typed up.
18 This is yours. It has been typed up. I am not
19 suggesting you saw it in its typed form. Can I just
20 take you through part of it. There is a Q2, about a
21 third of the way down.
22 It says: "Where were you coming from? (details)", and
23 what it has you saying is you "coming from [the] Coach in
24 Banbridge, arrived about 1.30 - 1.45 am, went to
25 Boss Hoggs, [the] place [was] packed, tried two taxis." And
2
1 then "Who was with you?", you say "Conor Black", maybe
2 somebody else, "Johnny Nelson" and "Kyle Magee". "Who else
3 was in the vicinity?", and the answer attributed to you
4 there is "Talking to Kyle Magee just prior to assault.
5 Got offside quickly. Didn't recognise anybody in the
6 vicinity."
7 From the bottom: "Did you see an assault in
8 Market Street? If so give details", then "Yes, seen bad
9 fight starting and got offside by going off towards the
10 church."
11 That's dated 2 May 1997. Do you remember being
12 asked those questions then?
13 A. No.
14 Q. This was a police officer called Basil Lilly. Do you
15 remember a police officer called that?
16 A. No.
17 Q. Do you remember any conversations with police officers
18 at about that time?
19 A. Not really, no. I can't really remember, no.
20 Q. If you had been seen by the police and asked questions,
21 would you have told them the truth?
22 A. I would have surely, yes.
23 Q. With the aid of that, I understand you say you can't
24 remember saying this, but now you have seen the model
25 that I have shown you, now you have seen this, what's
3
1 your recollection of the night?
2 A. That night I had a lot to drink. I was -- a lot of
3 alcohol taken. The details at the time I was asked
4 these questions or whatnot were very, very sketchy, and
5 now I just, 12 years on, it's sort of non-existent.
6 Q. Do you remember being asked the questions then?
7 A. No.
8 Q. Why did you say the details when you were asked the
9 questions was sketchy?
10 A. I know that I had a lot of drink taken that night.
11 Q. Mm-hm. If we look at page [09151], this was a witness
12 statement which is taken from you by a different police
13 officer, Mr Williamson, on 29 May 1997, and it says that
14 on 26th you had been to the Coach in Banbridge and you
15 got the bus back to Portadown at about a quarter past 1.
16 Can you remember that?
17 A. I don't remember making a statement, no.
18 Q. I should have been clearer. Do you remember whether you
19 did in fact go to the Coach Inn?
20 A. If it says that, referring to that, I must have. That
21 would be the truth.
22 Q. Then second sentence:
23 "The bus got into Portadown at about 25 or 20 to 2
24 in the morning. I got off the bus at Z Cabs and
25 intended going home."
4
1 Again, that is likely to be true, is it?
2 A. It is, yes.
3 Q. "I tried to get a taxi at Z Cabs and Eden Cabs but there
4 was none available so I went up to Boss Hoggs to get
5 something to eat."
6 If you remember, back in that questionnaire you had
7 said you had tried to get two cabs, and here what you
8 are doing is naming two cab companies. Any recollection
9 of that?
10 A. Just from reading the statement, it must be true if
11 it's in there, yes.
12 Q. Then "Went up to Boss Hoggs to try to get something to eat.
13 At that stage I'd have been with
14 Timothy Jameson and Kyle Magee."
15 Do you remember being with them?
16 A. Again, if it is in there, I was with them.
17 Q. We know certainly that they gave statements which said
18 the same thing.
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. Then "On coming out of Boss Hoggs I walked up through
21 the centre of town, intending to try to get a taxi home from
22 Call-A-Cab. I walked up slightly in front of Timmy and
23 Kyle. At about the traffic lights in the centre of the
24 town I saw a fight start. This was in the middle of the
25 road. I thought it just a normal sort of Saturday night
5
1 fight and didn't want to get involved, so walked on past
2 it."
3 Again, any recollection?
4 A. If it's there, I seen it, and I walked on, you know.
5 There's -- that would be the truth that is in there.
6 Q. Nobody suggested, and nobody is suggesting now, that you
7 got involved in the fight. Are you the sort of person
8 who kept away from fights if you saw them?
9 A. I would have been, yes.
10 Q. Was it a common event to see a fight there?
11 A. Not really. I wouldn't really be up the town that much.
12 So I wouldn't have seen...
13 Q. You go on to give some detail there:
14 "There seemed to be about four or five people
15 involved in the fight. I can't describe any of them.
16 There wasn't anybody lying on the ground just fellas
17 beating the head of each other."
18 Again, have you any recollection of that?
19 A. No, but as I said there, I just walked on past it, so it
20 would have been to my back.
21 Q. But if you put it in here, it would be true?
22 A. It would be absolutely true, yes.
23 Q. Then:
24 "I walked on to about the Progressive Building Society
25 where I stopped to talk to a girl, Tracey Clarke."
6
1 Do you remember her?
2 A. I remember -- I know her, but I don't remember stopping
3 talking to her.
4 Q. See if it helps you with your memory. Can I show you
5 her witness statement at page [00263], the first half.
6 On the top line there, towards the right-hand side she
7 says:
8 "I met up with Stephen Bloomer at Poundstretcher and
9 I just sat down beside him. I saw two people lying on
10 the street, one was near the centre of the road and the
11 other was near the footpath close to Eastwoods. The
12 person I saw in the middle of the road I thought was
13 dead as he was not moving. It was at this time I saw a
14 number of persons gathered round the person lying in the
15 centre of the road. These persons were kicking the
16 person on the ground around the head and body. I saw
17 them jump on the person on the ground. They jumped all
18 over him and kicked him. I saw the persons who were
19 doing this and I can identify them as follows
20 ..."
21 And she gives some names. I will come to the names
22 in a minute. Does that help you recall what you will
23 have seen?
24 A. No, because referring to my statement, I was actually
25 walking up the town. So that would all have been behind
7
1 me.
2 Q. You don't remember sitting down with her?
3 A. No.
4 Q. If you had seen this, is there any reason why you
5 wouldn't have told the police?
6 A. No reason whatsoever. As I say, I was walking away from
7 it, so it would have been behind me and I couldn't say
8 I had seen anything if I didn't see it.
9 Q. Then we come to these names, and I want to know, first
10 of all, if these are names that are familiar to you at
11 all. Dean Forbes?
12 A. I don't think I know him, no. I think I maybe just know
13 him to see, I wouldn't know him as friendly or anything.
14 Q. Would you attach the name to the face if you saw him?
15 A. Probably, yes.
16 Q. Allister Hanvey?
17 A. Again, I would know him to see.
18 Q. Stacey Bridgett?
19 A. I would know him to see, yeah.
20 Q. Muck, that is Marc Hobson?
21 A. No.
22 Q. Rory Robinson?
23 A. No.
24 Q. What about Michelle Jamieson?
25 A. I don't know her at all, no.
8
1 Q. Okay. And going back to your statement at [09151], at
2 the bottom, you say you walked on. You stopped to talk
3 to Tracey Clarke and you say you heard shouting:
4 "I think women shouting, 'Leave him alone'. There
5 was a lot of shouting. But I can't really say what it
6 was."
7 Any recollection of that?
8 A. No.
9 Q. Again, if you had heard the shouting and turned round to
10 see what was happening, would you have told the police
11 that?
12 A. I think just on that, I would have told the police of
13 course, yes. On that, but I was just trying to get out
14 of the road, you know.
15 Q. Okay. Then it goes on:
16 "I also heard sirens, both police and ambulance.
17 The ambulance one at a bit of a distance. I saw then
18 two people lying on the ground."
19 One of the things that the Inquiry is really very
20 interested in indeed is when the police got out of the
21 Land Rover and what they were doing. If you could help
22 us with that at all, we would be grateful. Can you
23 recall anything of this?
24 A. Just as it says there, as I was walking up, there must
25 have been police out there, because reading through
9
1 that, it says there was a man with a baton round gun
2 there, so he must have been out at some stage.
3 Q. You have already told us that if it's in your statement,
4 you would have been telling the truth at the time?
5 A. Yeah, mm-hm.
6 Q. Can you recall whether you were put under any pressure
7 or words were put in your mouth by any police officers?
8 A. No, I wouldn't think so, no.
9 Q. So if your statement tells us police were there,
10 starting to move people back, then that would have been
11 your evidence, what you were telling voluntarily?
12 A. That would have been true, yeah.
13 Q. And then, as you say, you saw a policeman, it says here,
14 with a plastic baton round gun. You didn't want to be
15 anywhere near the place, so you walked away.
16 What this is having, really, is -- similar to what
17 you are telling us now, you are walking away from it,
18 but there what it's doing is having you stop shortly and
19 having a very quick look and then walking on again.
20 Could that be right?
21 A. It could be, yes. Mm-hm.
22 Q. And then you try to get yet another taxi, this time from
23 Call-A-Cab, and then you went to walk back in the
24 direction of home. What direction that was, up
25 West Street?
10
1 A. Call-A-Cab would be up West Street, yeah.
2 Q. You stay you were stopped in West Street by the police
3 and weren't allowed to go through the town. We know
4 that later on you went to a gathering at
5 Tracy McAlpine's house. Do you remember that?
6 A. If it's in there, yes.
7 Q. Do you recall it, though?
8 A. No.
9 Q. All right. And do you recall how long you stayed there?
10 A. It says I stayed for about 15 minutes, so that must
11 have been how long I was there.
12 Q. Would you accept, because there are other versions of
13 this coming from different people who were with you, who
14 say you would have been there longer; have you any
15 recollection?
16 A. No.
17 Q. All right. Do you remember seeing Allister Hanvey at
18 the gathering?
19 A. It says there, yes.
20 Q. Do you recall it?
21 A. No. But as I say, I wouldn't know anybody there, so
22 I wouldn't stay that long.
23 Q. If we look at page [70957], this is another one of these
24 questionnaires. It is in a different set of questions,
25 but similar idea. We don't have a date on this one, but
11
1 we think it is probably late 2000, possibly early 2001.
2 Again it's you, and again it's been typed up.
3 Again here, if we look roughly in the middle of
4 this, "With Timothy Jameson and Kyle Magee. Saw [a] fight,
5 was about 100 yards away at time, at the Progressive
6 Building Society. Spoke to Tracey Clarke, saw police in
7 [the] middle of fight. Policeman with baton gun." And you
8 "walked on to Z Cabs". Obviously, that's consistent with
9 what you had said in your witness statement?
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. Do you remember this questionnaire?
12 A. Not really, no. No.
13 Q. Can you help us with whether you were shown a witness
14 statement or shown your earlier witness statement when
15 you made this?
16 A. I'm not sure. I can't answer that.
17 Q. All right. If we go to page [70960], you see at the top
18 there:
19 "Who did you leave with and where did you go?"
20 And it says:
21 "Must have left with Chris Henderson and
22 Iain Carville. If Kyle Magee was there I would have
23 left with him as well. That's the boys I knocked about
24 with."
25 Can you help us with whether you remember that or
12
1 not?
2 A. If it's down there, it's absolutely true.
3 Q. All right. Iain Carville in fact told the police that
4 you and he had left at about 5.30. Can you help us on
5 that?
6 A. That's for Iain to answer. It was before that, I would
7 have thought, I left.
8 Q. Okay. Can I show you page [09144]? This is
9 Kyle Magee's witness statement, and if we pick up the
10 first half, if we look about five lines down, in the
11 middle of a line:
12 "I think Timothy Jameson and Stephen Bloomer were
13 standing beside us."
14 Do you see that?
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. It goes on:
17 "The next thing I saw was a crowd starting to fight
18 on the middle of the street, at the junction of
19 Woodhouse Street with Thomas Street. There would have
20 been about twenty fighting. I started to walk towards the
21 fight and Victoria and Jennifer walked with me. I am
22 not sure if Timothy and Stephen came up the street. I
23 got near the fight, I got close to it."
24 Again, any recollection of that incident?
25 A. In my statement it says that I walked on ahead in front
13
1 of them ones, so I don't think that's right there at
2 all.
3 Q. Okay. One other matter I want to ask you about. Can we
4 have a look at page [80075]. This is a witness
5 statement that was drafted for you by the Inquiry, and
6 if we just scroll through the three pages of it, you
7 have seen this, I think, haven't you?
8 A. I have, yes.
9 Q. Have you been advised not to sign it?
10 A. I have been, yes.
11 Q. And have you had a chance to check whether it's
12 accurate?
13 A. Just looking through it, yes, there's one thing in it
14 that I can't see being accurate.
15 Q. What is a that?
16 A. That I have heard of Constable P40. I have
17 never heard that name in my life.
18 MR UNDERWOOD: Thank you very much. As I say, other people
19 may have questions for you.
20 Examination by MR FERGUSON
21 MR FERGUSON: Mr Bloomer, who advised you not to sign the
22 statement?
23 A. My solicitor.
24 Q. Which solicitor?
25 A. In Richard Monteith's office.
14
1 Q. Mr Monteith's office?
2 A. Yes.
3 Q. And you consulted him after you had made this statement
4 to the Tribunal, did you?
5 A. I have only ever seen this statement a couple of days
6 ago.
7 Q. Well, you accept, as I understand it, the contents of
8 your early statement which you made to the police; is
9 that right?
10 A. Sorry, could you repeat the question, please?
11 Q. Yes. You accept the contents of your early statement
12 which you made to the police?
13 A. Yes.
14 Q. Clearly, this was a night in Portadown which was very
15 infamous indeed; isn't that right?
16 A. It would be, yes.
17 Q. And down the years there has been discussion about it;
18 isn't that right?
19 A. Just through the media and stuff.
20 Q. But it's always been in the public limelight and, no
21 doubt, discussed among people in Portadown?
22 A. Not with me, but through the media, yes.
23 Q. Not with you?
24 A. No.
25 Q. You knew you were coming here to give evidence today to
15
1 the Inquiry to assist?
2 A. Yes, mm-hm.
3 Q. Did you discuss what you would say, for instance, with
4 Timothy Jameson?
5 A. No.
6 Q. You didn't?
7 A. No.
8 Q. Did you say to him, "Look, I have been asked to go along
9 to the Inquiry to give evidence. I have forgotten now
10 what happened that night, can you remember what
11 happened?" No conversation like that?
12 A. No, no.
13 Q. And I am not entitled, and I don't ask you, what took
14 place between you and your solicitor, but did you
15 discuss with no one the fact that you were coming to
16 give evidence to see what their recollection was of what
17 took place?
18 A. No.
19 Q. I appreciate it's a number of years ago now, but have
20 you any idea or can you give us any assistance as to
21 when you lost your memory of what took place that night?
22 A. Most of that would have been gone, you know, within the
23 next couple of weeks after it happened. I was pretty
24 intoxicated that night.
25 Q. You don't mention that, that you were pretty intoxicated
16
1 in your statement that you did make to the police?
2 A. I am sure I would have said that because that's how it
3 was. When I went out in them sort of days, that is how
4 it was.
5 Q. Are you suggesting you told the police that and they
6 didn't put it in the statement?
7 A. I'm sure I would have, yes.
8 Q. The events of that night were, if not unique, certainly
9 very much out of the ordinary, weren't they?
10 A. I would say so, yes, of course.
11 Q. And as I understand it from your statements, and
12 I accept it entirely, you really have had no dealings or
13 had no dealings with the police prior to that?
14 A. Not that I'm aware of, no.
15 Q. No. So you weren't fearful of the police in any way?
16 A. No reason to be, no.
17 Q. And you would do your best, would you, to assist us now?
18 A. I would indeed.
19 Q. With your recollection?
20 A. Of course.
21 Q. Just so I get it absolutely clear in my mind, are you
22 saying you have absolutely no recollection of any event
23 such as this taking place in Portadown?
24 A. No. I have never seen fights or anything up at the town
25 there, if that's what you are saying.
17
1 Q. It has gone from your memory completely?
2 A. Yes. As I said, I was pretty drunk.
3 Q. Has anyone suggested to you that you should say it's
4 gone from your memory completely?
5 A. No, no. I am here to tell the truth.
6 Q. And was there never discussion between you and your pals
7 who were with you that night down the years about what
8 was taking place and what might happen?
9 A. No.
10 Q. Never mentioned between you?
11 A. Never mentioned, no.
12 Q. No concern that in some way or other, wrongly, may
13 I say, that you might be blamed for having some part in
14 it?
15 A. Definitely not, no.
16 Q. I'm not suggesting that you had, but was that
17 not something which was mentioned?
18 A. Why would I be blamed when I had nothing to do with it?
19 I just wanted to get out of the road of it.
20 Examination by MR O'HARE
21 MR O'HARE: Just a couple of matters, Mr Bloomer. You were
22 friendly with Timothy Jameson in April 1997?
23 A. I would have been, yes.
24 Q. And perhaps if page [09151] could be put up again,
25 please. It's really the whole of that page.
18
1 You describe in that, about six lines down, how you
2 tried to get the taxi, at both Z Cabs and Eden Cabs but
3 there was none available:
4 "... so I went up to Boss Hoggs to get something
5 to eat. At that stage I would have been with
6 Timothy Jameson and Kyle Magee."
7 When you said that in your statement, did you mean
8 that you went up to Boss Hoggs in the company of
9 Timothy Jameson and Kyle Magee?
10 A. I am not sure, but I think I would probably have seen
11 them up there.
12 Q. If we go on:
13 "On coming out of Boss Hoggs, I walked up through
14 the centre of town intending to try to get a taxi home
15 ..."
16 That's what your statement reads:
17 "... and I walked up slightly in front of Timmy and
18 Kyle."
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. "At about the traffic lights in the centre of the town
21 I saw a fight start. This was in the middle of the
22 road."
23 How far approximately then from this fight that
24 started would you have been when you noticed this?
25 A. Well, at the traffic lights I would have been just to my
19
1 side, basically, wouldn't have been that far at all.
2 Q. 10, 15 yards?
3 A. Something like that, yes.
4 Q. And at this stage, can you say were Kyle Magee and
5 Timothy Jameson still coming slightly behind you?
6 A. They would have been probably behind me, yes.
7 Q. And when you use the expression "slightly behind you",
8 can you give us any indication of what sort of distance
9 we are talking about?
10 A. I couldn't tell you. I would say my back was to them,
11 so I don't know how far away.
12 Q. When you use in the statement the word "slightly", can
13 you give us any indication of what you meant?
14 A. Slightly, I would say about 15 yards, 20 yards,
15 something like that.
16 Q. 15 yards. In any event, you saw this fight, and you
17 described it as about four or five people?
18 A. Yes.
19 Q. And it started in the middle of the road. So somebody
20 coming behind you, that would have been to their right
21 as well?
22 A. It would have been, yes.
23 Q. And in the middle of the road?
24 A. Mm-hm.
25 Q. And could I take it you had no difficulty seeing these
20
1 four or five people start to fight in the middle of the
2 road?
3 A. It says there I have seen them, so I have seen them.
4 Q. You didn't want to get involved in this, understandably
5 so, so you walked on?
6 A. Yes.
7 Q. And you said in your statement that you went as far as
8 the Progressive Building Society and you stopped there?
9 A. Mm-hm and.
10 Q. Can you give us any indication of the distance then,
11 approximately, from the Progressive Building Society to
12 where this fight was going on?
13 A. I think it is about 100 yards or so.
14 Q. In any event, you go on to describe that when you were
15 at the Progressive Building Society you could hear
16 shouting?
17 A. Mm-hm.
18 Q. You could hear women shouting?
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. You could hear sirens?
21 A. Yes.
22 Q. And in fact you seem to have been able to distinguish
23 between a police siren and an ambulance?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. It was at that stage at the Progressive Building Society
21
1 you could see two people lying on the ground?
2 A. Yes.
3 Q. You could see that quite clearly from where you were
4 standing?
5 A. I must have, yes.
6 Q. You say there were police there starting to move the
7 people back?
8 A. Mm-hm.
9 Q. Do you recall how they were starting to move these
10 people back?
11 A. They must have been just pushing them back.
12 Q. Do you recall in which direction they were pushing them
13 back?
14 A. No.
15 Q. These police were out on the ground?
16 A. Yes.
17 Q. And you have said in your statement that you recall one
18 officer with a plastic baton gun?
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. You then walked over to the church, and Kyle and Timmy,
21 and, I take it, that's Timothy Jameson?
22 A. Must be, yes.
23 Q. Were standing over at the church?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. And you went over to them?
22
1 A. Yes.
2 Q. Do you recall having any conversation with them at the
3 church?
4 A. No.
5 MR O'HARE: Thank you, Mr Bloomer.
6 Examination by MR McGRORY
7 MR McGRORY: Mr Bloomer, I want to ask you some questions on
8 behalf of the Hamill family.
9 You were interviewed by the Inquiry on 24
10 March 2006. Do you recall that?
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. And do you remember being notified by the Inquiry that
13 they would like to speak to you?
14 A. Not really, no. It was maybe a couple of years before
15 that, maybe. I am not sure.
16 Q. Well, did a letter drop through the post or was it
17 a phone call?
18 A. It would have been a letter through the post, yes.
19 Q. Obviously the Inquiry had to contact you to arrange the
20 date of 24 March, relatively close to that?
21 A. Yes, they would have, yes.
22 Q. And did that cause you any concern that you were going
23 to have to go and speak about these events?
24 A. Not really, no. No.
25 Q. Now, at the time of this incident, back in 1997 you were
23
1 friendly with Timothy Jameson and Kyle Magee; isn't that
2 correct?
3 A. That's correct, yes.
4 Q. Are you still friendly with them?
5 A. Kyle Magee just.
6 Q. Kyle Magee was interviewed by the Inquiry on 17 May,
7 a few months later.
8 A. Mm-hm.
9 Q. And you didn't have any occasion to speak to him about
10 what you might be saying to the Inquiry, no?
11 A. No.
12 Q. You didn't happen to say to him: "Did you get one of
13 these letters or phone calls?"
14 A. I probably did, I'm sure I did, yeah.
15 Q. You didn't contact Timothy Jameson, by any chance?
16 A. Definitely not, no.
17 Q. But you took the decision to seek representation, didn't
18 you?
19 A. Yeah.
20 Q. Why did you think you needed representation?
21 A. Because it's my right to have it.
22 Q. Yes, it's your right to have it?
23 A. Mm-hm.
24 Q. But that's not the reason why you would need it?
25 A. I just -- I wanted to have it. If it's there, I might
24
1 as well as have it as not have it.
2 Q. Yes, but do you agree that one needs representation for
3 a purpose, that if you might feel at risk you might need
4 it?
5 A. No.
6 Q. Did anyone else suggest to you that you should have
7 representation?
8 A. No.
9 Q. Were you aware that Kyle Magee needed representation or
10 was going to get representation?
11 A. I wasn't aware, no.
12 Q. Well, when you were deciding who would represent you,
13 did you speak to anybody seeking a recommendation for
14 a solicitor?
15 A. No.
16 Q. So you went to Richard Monteith's office?
17 A. Mm-hm.
18 Q. Had you been to Richard Monteith's office before?
19 A. I had been, yes.
20 Q. Now, I am not going to ask you either about what it was
21 you were advised by Mr Monteith, but what I'm going to
22 point out is the Inquiry is facing a difficulty here in
23 that there are quite a number of people who seem to have
24 blanked this incident from their memories completely.
25 A. Right.
25
1 Q. And you are one of them.
2 A. Mm-hm.
3 Q. And I'm going to suggest to you that there was
4 conversation amongst people in Portadown about how they
5 were going to approach this Inquiry?
6 A. If you suggest that, yeah.
7 Q. Now, did you speak to Kyle Magee, or Timothy Jameson or
8 anybody else?
9 A. Definitely not, no.
10 Q. At the time these letters from coming from this Inquiry,
11 asking people to come for interview around the spring of
12 2006, are you seriously suggesting that there was no
13 contact between the people in Portadown, who were
14 involved in the incident, about how they might deal with
15 it?
16 A. I'm not sure if there was or not, but with me there
17 wasn't. I was only walking up the street.
18 Q. So the fact that you say you can remember nothing about
19 what happened that night is a coincidence?
20 A. It is not a coincidence. It is down to a lot of alcohol
21 being taken.
22 Q. But you have already this morning accepted the truth of
23 the statement you made in 1997?
24 A. Yes.
25 Q. And you remembered then?
26
1 A. I remembered then, it was like a week's after it.
2 12 years has passed now.
3 Q. But the alcohol hadn't dampened your memory then?
4 A. As I said earlier on, the details were pretty sketchy at
5 the time.
6 Q. But there is a lot more detail in that statement than
7 there is today?
8 A. Yeah. As I say, it is hard to remember, you know. As
9 I say, the details were sketchy at that time, so now
10 they are non-existent.
11 Q. Is it not your experience that if your memory is dimmed
12 by alcohol, that sometimes it improves with time?
13 A. Not really, no.
14 Q. In the weeks afterwards?
15 A. No.
16 Q. But you have suggested that the reason why you didn't
17 remember -- you can't remember anything today is because
18 of the alcohol?
19 A. I'm saying -- what I'm saying to you is it was a long
20 time ago and I had a lot to drink that night. The
21 details were sketchy at that time.
22 Q. What I'm suggesting to you, Mr Bloomer, is you have just
23 made up that answer.
24 A. No.
25 Q. And the reason you have made up that answer is you don't
27
1 want to tell this Inquiry anything about what happened.
2 A. That is not correct, no.
3 Q. And that you and all of those who were involved in this
4 have taken a collective decision to come to this Inquiry
5 to say you can't remember anything about what happened.
6 A. I wasn't involved in anything. I was walking up the
7 road.
8 MR McGRORY: Very well.
9 MS DINSMORE: No questions.
10 MR McCOMB: No questions.
11 THE CHAIRMAN: Very well.
12 MR UNDERWOOD: Nothing arising, thank you very much.
13 Questions from THE PANEL
14 THE CHAIRMAN: Just help me about one thing. You said your
15 memory of these events had gone about a fortnight
16 afterwards?
17 A. Gone, yes.
18 THE CHAIRMAN: I would like you, please, to have a look at
19 page [70957]. You see what you are saying there. You
20 "got [the] bus back from [the] Coach, got off at Z Cabs", and
21 you "saw [the] police in [the] middle of [the] fight.
22 A policeman with a baton gun. Walked on to Z Cabs, met
23 Kyle and Timmy, and walked to Brownstown."
24 "Were you in the vicinity of the
25 scene of the incident? - Yes." Can we go on to the next
28
1 page, please? "Were you at a party at Tracy McAlpine's
2 house... ? - Yes. What time did you arrive? - ... about half past
3 two. Who did you arrive with? - I think Chris Henderson
4 and maybe Kyle. At the party do you recall any person
5 with injuries? - No. What were the injuries and what was
6 discussed in relation to them? No answer. Did you see
7 a person called Groggs at the party? What do you know
8 about him? - I know him to see, but I don't know his
9 right name... Whose company was he in? [we see lower
10 down the page] - It was just like a living room, everybody
11 sitting about it. Half of them guys I didn't know them,
12 that's why I only stayed for the duration I did."
13 And so it goes on.
14 Now, you have told us, and repeated it, that your
15 memory of the events had gone after about a fortnight.
16 A. Yeah.
17 THE CHAIRMAN: But you realise this, you were told, is your
18 questionnaire late in 2000 or early in 2001?
19 A. Mm-hm.
20 THE CHAIRMAN: And your memory seems to be persisting then?
21 A. Yeah.
22 THE CHAIRMAN: Do you see the inconsistency between
23 a fortnight and two to three years?
24 A. Yeah.
25 THE CHAIRMAN: Now, can you explain it to us, please?
29
1 A. It must be just what was in the statement, that I have
2 put down there.
3 THE CHAIRMAN: In what statement?
4 A. The statement I gave to the police.
5 THE CHAIRMAN: Had you got that statement with you when you
6 were interviewed?
7 A. I'm not sure. I must have, yes.
8 THE CHAIRMAN: You must have had it with you?
9 A. I must have seen it before that.
10 THE CHAIRMAN: Had you been provided with a copy of your
11 witness statement?
12 A. I'm not sure.
13 THE CHAIRMAN: That can be no doubt checked and practice of
14 the police in these matters can be looked into.
15 A. Okay. I am not sure whether I had it or not.
16 THE CHAIRMAN: That's all you can think of, is it, that you
17 must have seen all this in your witness statement and
18 were able then to feedback this information in this
19 questionnaire?
20 A. It must be, yeah.
21 THE CHAIRMAN: Again, the information you gave in the
22 questionnaire can be compared with what was said in your
23 witness statement.
24 A. Okay.
25 THE CHAIRMAN: Very well.
30
1 Now, in your witness statement, and we have seen in
2 this questionnaire, you named certain people. Is that
3 right?
4 A. Where is that?
5 THE CHAIRMAN: Well, I am not going to take you through it,
6 but there are a number of names you mentioned and you
7 said you knew them by sight?
8 A. Mm-hm.
9 THE CHAIRMAN: It's quite clear if you were able to put
10 names to them, you knew them by sight and were able to
11 put names to them. Is that right?
12 A. It must have been.
13 THE CHAIRMAN: You are free now to go.
14 (The witness withdrew)
15 MR UNDERWOOD: Sir, as you know, I was proposing to call
16 Iain Carville this morning. Iain Carville is not
17 represented and I think it may well be that the letter
18 requesting him to turn up today has gone astray. He has
19 been in contact with us, he signed a witness statement
20 and there is no reason to believe he is evading giving
21 evidence, but unhappily he is not here. So I'm going to
22 have to reschedule him, which means we have got through
23 all our witnesses for the week.
24 THE CHAIRMAN: Yes. Very well. Then 10.30 on Tuesday
25 morning.
31
1 (11.05 am)
2 (The hearing adjourned until Tuesday, 17 February 2009 at
3 10.30 am)
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
32
1 INDEX
2 PAGE
3 MR STEPHEN BLOOMER (sworn) ....................... 1
4
5 Examination by MR UNDERWOOD ............... 1
6
7 Examination by MR FERGUSON ................ 14
8
9 Examination by MR O'HARE .................. 18
10
11 Examination by MR McGRORY ................. 23
12
13 Questions from THE PANEL .................. 28
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
33
